mike1949 Posted April 25, 2009 Share Posted April 25, 2009 Your Driving Licence - Beware IS YOUR DRIVING LICENCE STILL VALID? Unwitting motorists face £1,000 fines as thousands of photo card driving licences expire. Thousands of motorists are at risk of being fined up to £1,000 because they are unwittingly driving without a valid licence. They risk prosecution after failing to spot the extremely small print on their photo card licence which says it automatically expires after 10 years and has to be renewed - even though drivers are licensed to drive until the age of 70. The fiasco has come to light a decade after the first batch of photo licences was issued in July 1998, just as they start to expire. Motoring organisations blamed the Government for the fiasco and said 'most' drivers believed their licences were for life. They said officials had failed to publicise sufficiently the fact that new-style licences - unlike the old paper ones - expire after a set period and have to be renewed. Stealth Tax To rub salt into wounds, drivers will have to a pay £17.50 to renew their card - a charge which critics have condemned as a 'stealth tax' and which will earn the Treasury an estimated £437million over 25 years. Official DVLA figures reveal that while 16,136 expired this summer, so far only 11,566 drivers have renewed, leaving 4,570 outstanding. With another 300,000 photo card licences due to expire over the coming year, experts fear the number of invalid licences will soar, putting thousands more drivers in breach of the law and at risk of a fine. At the heart of the confusion is the small print on the tiny credit-card-size photo licence, which is used in conjunction with the paper version. Just below the driver name on the front of the photo card licence is a series of dates and details - each one numbered. Tiny writing Number 4b features a date in tiny writing, but no explicit explanation as to what it means. The date's significance is only explained if the driver turns over the card and reads the key on the back which states that '4b' means 'licence valid to'. Even more confusingly, an adjacent table on the rear of the card sets out how long the driver is registered to hold a licence - that is until his or her 70th birthday. A total of 25 million new-style licences have been issued but - motoring experts say - drivers were never sufficiently warned they would expire after 10 years. £1,000 Fine Motorists who fail to renew their licences in time are allowed to continue driving. But the DVLA says they could be charged with 'failing to surrender their licence', an offence carrying a £1,000 fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine-star Posted April 25, 2009 Share Posted April 25, 2009 I have to say I didn't see that, but after looking I see I'm ok till 2016, interesting another way of making us pay more Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asmudgexj600 Posted April 25, 2009 Share Posted April 25, 2009 How does that work?? Mine's only valid till 2013, and I only got mine just over a year ago?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimR Posted April 25, 2009 Share Posted April 25, 2009 Your Driving Licence - Beware IS YOUR DRIVING LICENCE STILL VALID? Unwitting motorists face £1,000 fines as thousands of photo card driving licences expire. Thousands of motorists are at risk of being fined up to £1,000 because they are unwittingly driving without a valid licence. They risk prosecution after failing to spot the extremely small print on their photo card licence which says it automatically expires after 10 years and has to be renewed - even though drivers are licensed to drive until the age of 70. The fiasco has come to light a decade after the first batch of photo licences was issued in July 1998, just as they start to expire. Motoring organisations blamed the Government for the fiasco and said 'most' drivers believed their licences were for life. They said officials had failed to publicise sufficiently the fact that new-style licences - unlike the old paper ones - expire after a set period and have to be renewed. Stealth Tax To rub salt into wounds, drivers will have to a pay £17.50 to renew their card - a charge which critics have condemned as a 'stealth tax' and which will earn the Treasury an estimated £437million over 25 years. Official DVLA figures reveal that while 16,136 expired this summer, so far only 11,566 drivers have renewed, leaving 4,570 outstanding. With another 300,000 photo card licences due to expire over the coming year, experts fear the number of invalid licences will soar, putting thousands more drivers in breach of the law and at risk of a fine. At the heart of the confusion is the small print on the tiny credit-card-size photo licence, which is used in conjunction with the paper version. Just below the driver name on the front of the photo card licence is a series of dates and details - each one numbered. Tiny writing Number 4b features a date in tiny writing, but no explicit explanation as to what it means. The date's significance is only explained if the driver turns over the card and reads the key on the back which states that '4b' means 'licence valid to'. Even more confusingly, an adjacent table on the rear of the card sets out how long the driver is registered to hold a licence - that is until his or her 70th birthday. A total of 25 million new-style licences have been issued but - motoring experts say - drivers were never sufficiently warned they would expire after 10 years. £1,000 Fine Motorists who fail to renew their licences in time are allowed to continue driving. But the DVLA says they could be charged with 'failing to surrender their licence', an offence carrying a £1,000 fine. Hi from what I can see it's the photo that needs to be changed in the 10 year span the entilement will remain if the licence is renewed, you didnt mention passports which have the same 'shelf life'(how much does a passport cost ?) and their renewal is down to the photo not dipicting how you currently look.. with regard to 4b on the front of the card it rang bells with me as 4a gives you the start date... so 4b will be the end date .. simple if you flip my card over I have some entilments running out in 2030 and some in 2014 but the overall card running out in 2014 ... Ok if you dont drive for a living the card is just a 'new fangled' thing but it would be better if you read the notes that came with it & understood what each field/box ment. As I am a HGV driver I tend to read all licence notes to insure that I still have the correct licence to drive the said vehicle but I can imagine a std licence holder would just throw it all in a drawer . oddly enuff I have the card run out in 07/14 and one entitlement run out in 04/14 so I will have to pay twice, I guess you will not have that problem as your photo will last 10 years and your licence until your 70 ... as long as you renew it with a fresh pic so if your happy to renew a passport what is wrong with your licence being updated ? Ok at a cost but from the figures you mention well less than a passport. Oh dont forget that you may need to do your tacho card and cpc at the same time more expense but if you want to drive you need to be safe ! Regards Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike1949 Posted April 25, 2009 Author Share Posted April 25, 2009 How does that work?? Mine's only valid till 2013, and I only got mine just over a year ago?! In all honesty I don't know, I'm one of the older paper licence holders but for some reason I received this as an e.mail from my breakdown recovery people and thought I would pass it on to the forum. Reading into it a photo licence only lasts for 10 years, if what your saying yours only lasts for 5 years I would certainly look into it. I'm not trying to scaremonger but I do think it ought to be made aware to all bikers. Also on the same note I remember some years ago that if you sent your photo licence of to DVLA for some reason i.e. to have points endorsed, when it came back the motorcycle qualification had been erased. This might have been resolved by now, but it might be wise just to check. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike1949 Posted April 25, 2009 Author Share Posted April 25, 2009 "you didnt mention passports" No I didn't mention passports because everybody Knows that passports have an expiry date, but how many people know that a photo licence has an expiry date? Obviously you are a professionly driver so I would expect you to know, but what I want to do is make aware the majority of bikers that are of a younger age. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike1949 Posted April 25, 2009 Author Share Posted April 25, 2009 Also as well JimR if you turn up whith an invalid passport it not an offence, but if you ride a bike with an invalid driving licence it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimR Posted April 25, 2009 Share Posted April 25, 2009 In all honesty I don't know, I'm one of the older paper licence holders but for some reason I received this as an e.mail from my breakdown recovery people and thought I would pass it on to the forum. Reading into it a photo licence only lasts for 10 years, if what your saying yours only lasts for 5 years I would certainly look into it. I'm not trying to scaremonger but I do think it ought to be made aware to all bikers. Also on the same note I remember some years ago that if you sent your photo licence of to DVLA for some reason i.e. to have points endorsed, when it came back the motorcycle qualification had been erased. This might have been resolved by now, but it might be wise just to check. Hi, dont forget the picture upgrade as in previous msg but by the same token it is good that HGV/LGV drivers are given a 5 year life on their licence there is a chance that the driver may not be able to drive any more due to medical reasons ok m/c riders perhaps should be within the same restriction as modern bikes are as dangerous as drivers of large trucks. The pic will last for 10 years .. the same as a passport so a renewed licence may only have 5 years to go when renewed ... I just cannot see the problem if you read the t&c's it tells you Regards Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike1949 Posted April 25, 2009 Author Share Posted April 25, 2009 ... I just cannot see the problem if you read the t&c's it tells you Regards Jim What are t&c's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimR Posted April 25, 2009 Share Posted April 25, 2009 Also as well JimR if you turn up whith an invalid passport it not an offence, but if you ride a bike with an invalid driving licence it is. Hi, Thats what I am saying if you have a photo card you need to update it in the same time as a passport .. passport=10 years photo licence=10 years so If I go to the far east with an out of date passport they will 'turn a blind eye' so if you do say that as my passport runs out in about a week or 2 from now and have a trip planed in september so can I have your insurance that my passport will be good for that trip and I will not be inprisoined for not having the correct documents ?I guess you will not insure me ... same as the driving docs ... but what ever you guys just get 'pulled' for an obvious over sight ... just up to you. Regards Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimR Posted April 25, 2009 Share Posted April 25, 2009 ... I just cannot see the problem if you read the t&c's it tells you Regards Jim What are t&c's? Hi Mike Terms & Conditions Regards Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike1949 Posted April 25, 2009 Author Share Posted April 25, 2009 Jim, I'm on your side and agree with you but what I am trying to do is enlighten all the younger bikers that aren't aware of the situation about the origional photo licence problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve m Posted April 25, 2009 Share Posted April 25, 2009 Hi, that the driver may not be able to drive any more due to medical reasons ok m/c riders perhaps should be within the same restriction as modern bikes are as dangerous as drivers of large trucks. Regards Jim Hi Jim,, I think the Goverment and thousends of car drivers will be pleased to read that comment !! Ooohhhh and don`t froget the push bike brigade ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator mervin Posted April 25, 2009 Moderator Share Posted April 25, 2009 Hi, dont forget the picture upgrade as in previous msg but by the same token it is good that HGV/LGV drivers are given a 5 year life on their licence there is a chance that the driver may not be able to drive any more due to medical reasons ok m/c riders perhaps should be within the same restriction as modern bikes are as dangerous as drivers of large trucks. The pic will last for 10 years .. the same as a passport so a renewed licence may only have 5 years to go when renewed ... I just cannot see the problem if you read the t&c's it tells you Regards Jim HGV/PSV licences run from the date of your test pass too age 45 then you have to have a medical to renew it every 5 years after that, you sayit is a good job that we have this but surely it would be sensible if all drivers had this, how much damage could a middle age fatso in a porsche/merc etc doing 100 + mph on the motorway do if they had a heart attack, how many 60 + year olds are driving around with faded eyesight that are too stupidly stubborn not admit to it, or do anything about it , in fact looking at it most likely the most dangerous vehicles on the road are cars and vans being driven by undertrained numptys that think driving licenses are a god given right,,and as soon as you pass your test all you have to do is put your foot flat on the floorboards and stuff everyone else on the road, Not a privilege to be earned that can be removed , and not learning from their mistakes cos they reckon everyone else is wrong, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimR Posted April 25, 2009 Share Posted April 25, 2009 Jim, I'm on your side and agree with you but what I am trying to do is enlighten all the younger bikers that aren't aware of the situation about the origional photo licence problems. Hi Mike, as being a lgv driver you need to keep to be on top of DVLA/governent ideas and by the same point you need to read your licence in order to work out when the thing is invalid ... not DVLA's fault ... just yours they set the peraminters not you so I guess just abide with them so if you do not read that the photo card lasts until such point that you have got older ... 17 yr old with an A licence will lock some what different by the age 27 by the same token I will look different in 5 years time so It is good that LGV drivers need to renew and for sure high powered m/c licences should be the same ... I would guess the big scooter riders would disagree as they appear too be the worst ... from my point of view if I cannot drive a truck I can no longer ride a bike so I will give up both at such point when you become a danger to other people. Regards Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimR Posted April 25, 2009 Share Posted April 25, 2009 HGV/PSV licences run from the date of your test pass too age 45 then you have to have a medical to renew it every 5 years after that, you sayit is a good job that we have this but surely it would be sensible if all drivers had this, how much damage could a middle age fatso in a porsche/merc etc doing 100 + mph on the motorway do if they had a heart attack, how many 60 + year olds are driving around with faded eyesight that are too stupidly stubborn not admit to it, or do anything about it , in fact looking at it most likely the most dangerous vehicles on the road are cars and vans being driven by undertrained numptys that think driving licenses are a god given right,,and as soon as you pass your test all you have to do is put your foot flat on the floorboards and stuff everyone else on the road, Not a privilege to be earned that can be removed , and not learning from their mistakes cos they reckon everyone else is wrong, Thats fair enuff but I passed a class 1 test and only had 4 years .. ok I am well over 45 years old and the C licence thing runs out in 5 years but prior to that I had an extra time so does having a class 1 reduce the time the ticket is valid for ? I am well aware that the medical would appear to ensure the C type licence is still entact and I agree that guys in fast cars whatever their age are a menace gut also there is the boy racer element within m/c riders that for sure should go thro the same as I need to in order to retain my C catagory Regards Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterC Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 ...and don't forget that if you passed your A2 test you cannot just move to riding an unrestricted bike after two years - you have to get your licence changed as well, or risk a fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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