chrisw Posted September 10, 2008 Share Posted September 10, 2008 Never had any problem using parrafin at all, I've been riding years, use my bike all the time and in all weathers and, get decent milage from a chain, so it's not doing my chain any harm. Why should I spend £5 on 500ml of degreaser when I can spend £3 on a whole gallon of paraffin, it's not like I'm soaking the rubber over night in the stuff, and besides the type of rubber makes a lot of difference to the effect caused. As it's stated WD40 can cause rubber to swell but some guy's mentioned doing a test and proved it doesn't on the o rings. Agreed I'm not interested in winning an argument either we're all just giving our "counterpoints" that were asked for in the original comment by 'G-Man'. And as the for the Young and inexperienced or even the old and inexperienced ..... the manufacturers tell you to lube your chain for a reason, they advise a decent chain lube .. don't go thinking you know better than them .. cos you don't ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cy Welch Posted September 11, 2008 Share Posted September 11, 2008 Agree with everything you said except the parafin part. Parafin causes rubber to swell (trust me I've cleaned enough parts in Parafin parts washers). I would suggest using a degreaser rather than parafin, as the swelling from parafin also causes the rubber to become softer and therefore prone to damage. I have NO INTEREST IN WINNING ANY ARGUMENTS here. My concern is for the young and inexperienced riders. Clean & Lube your chains regularly I would (and have) use(d) parafin on traditional chains as it's in many ways superior for those, but I agree I would not use or recommend the use of parafin on o-ring chains. As a matter of fact, I would only recommend WD-40 for cleaning on traditional chains, while I would be very comfortable with it as lube on o-ring chains since your only trying to protect the outer surfaces from water and such (exactly what WD-40 was designed and intended for). Traditional chains require much better and penetrating lubrication and a good soak and simmer in parafin will do that quite well. On the clean and lube your chains regularly I think we are ALL in agreement, we just don't agree on the best way to do so. I think we are all putting forth the methods that have worked for us over the years, and frankly I'm not sure that this is not a case of all of us being correct mostly. Measuring the wear on my sprockets (did it this weekend) shows pretty much NO wear after at least 36,000 miles, but they are steel and I know most modern bikes have alloy sprockets of some sort and those clearly wear far faster. I also have been paying attention to newer bikes and their chains as compared to mine and noticed that they are quite wimpy compared to my chain, and since my HP is a bit lower I expect much higher wear rates that mine experiences. I guessing that like everything else, they just don't make them like they used to. Many areas are indeed better, (tighter tolerances etc) but things just generally are not built as tough, and they are indeed lighter, and IMHO not as strong, not necessarily a bad thing totatally, but I'm sure it make a difference in how long parts last. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-man Posted September 11, 2008 Author Share Posted September 11, 2008 For ChrisW: Regardless of what WD40 may say on it's website, I'm pretty sure that that will have been wrote well before the modern high powered high reving engines on todays Sports bikes... Actually, the reverse. The use of wd-40 on motorcycle chains had been debated long before I posted it here, but only recently did the manufacturer come out officially with their position after they got petitioned by a gaggle of motorcyclists. I could find you a link about all that if you like. I probably go OTT when I clean my clean my chain, I always use parrafin and a toothbrush, and about once a month clean in all the nooks and crannies of the chain (only a cold chain) and then let it spin in gear on a paddock stand and douse the sprockets/chain in fresh cold water this clears any muck left on. I then leave it running at above tickover for a few mins to let the water fling off. After it's dried I then give it a moderate application of a Dry chain lube. Then every week I lube the chain again immediatley after riding the bike as the heat in the chain melts the lube slightly allows it to seep past the x rings lubing the internal rollers. I get about 20k to a chain even with the attack of winter road salt. Well, I can't fault your cleaning routine, though I myself do a quick tidy-up of the chain more often than once a week. I'll have to disagree with you about lube bypassing your rubber rings on a warm chain. That's just unlikely unless your chain is so stretched that the rings no longer seal the pins, which at this point means that you really should replace your chain...coz riding on it will for sure wear out your sprockets, and then you'll be having to replace everthing as a set. Which means you'll be coming here and saying, "See Gene, I told you both need to be replaced together!" If you believe WD40 to be so good would you put it in your car engine instead of a proper engine oil ! But it won't work for long as the heat will breakdown the WD40 rendering it useless. What if I change the WD-40 every other day, haha? I'm only repeating myself here, but I'm saying that chains need more maintanance that are commonly given them, either with your method or mine. You wanna goop it up every few rides? Cool, I'm ok with that. As for the chain and sprocket debate, fitting a new chain to old sprokets will allow the chain to have to much for and aft movement as it sits on the sprocket because the gap betwen the teeth of the worn sprockets... If your sprockets are worn, change them. I never said otherwise. But if non of what we say is of interest to you then feel free to continue usng WD40 and replacing sprockets and chains at different times, and I hope that you're lucky enough not to suffer a drive train failure. Well, I'm certainly interested in opinions. In stupid accusations and condescending and dismissive comments though (I'm a troll, I'm stupid, I'm here to get a rise out of folks, blah blah fuckin blah), not so much. I don't take kindly to being disrespected, and so, am left to return the favor. But yes, I'm thoroughly committed to WD-40 with my present chain and sprockets, because my theory is that it's frequent application to the chain is adequate for both cleaning and lubrication. So far, the results are promising. Do you know anything about the scientific method? http://gigalock.com/sfiab/docs/20071210_ScientificMethod.png Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-man Posted September 11, 2008 Author Share Posted September 11, 2008 Agree with everything you said except the parafin part. Parafin causes rubber to swell (trust me I've cleaned enough parts in Parafin parts washers). I would suggest using a degreaser rather than parafin, as the swelling from parafin also causes the rubber to become softer and therefore prone to damage. Actual tests were conducted, and neither kerosine or wd-40 has been shown to affect o-rings in any discernable way. Even after a month-long soak in a bath of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-man Posted September 11, 2008 Author Share Posted September 11, 2008 I guessing that like everything else, they just don't make them like they used to. Many areas are indeed better, (tighter tolerances etc) but things just generally are not built as tough, and they are indeed lighter, and IMHO not as strong, not necessarily a bad thing totatally, but I'm sure it make a difference in how long parts last. Yes, yes indeed. My bike is 31 years old, with mostly everything on it still original. I have my doubts many of today's bikes will age that much, and with the same grace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Exupnutta Posted September 11, 2008 Share Posted September 11, 2008 Actual tests were conducted, and neither kerosine or wd-40 has been shown to affect o-rings in any discernable way. Even after a month-long soak in a bath of it. I'm inclined to trust my experience in the Motor trade / engineering for over 16 years. As Chris said, the type of rubber is important. If you use parafin (kerosene) on engine or gearbox o-rings, THEY WILL SWELL UP! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-man Posted September 11, 2008 Author Share Posted September 11, 2008 I'm inclined to trust my experience in the Motor trade / engineering for over 16 years. As Chris said, the type of rubber is important. If you use parafin (kerosene) on engine or gearbox o-rings, THEY WILL SWELL UP! If you will use parafin (kerosine) on motorcycle chain o-rings, THEY WILL NOT! I posted links to actual tests. If you're too lazy or stubborn to click them, that's your deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Exupnutta Posted September 11, 2008 Share Posted September 11, 2008 If you're too lazy or stubborn to click them, that's your deal. I didn't actually disagree... READ MY POST! You just like an argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChicagoXS Posted September 11, 2008 Share Posted September 11, 2008 I didn't actually disagree... READ MY POST! You just like an argument. Even though this Gman is from the same place as me, I have to disagree with a lot he says, and yes Exupnutta, I think he is the kind of guy who likes the argument. Ive only been on the forum a short while and was enjoying it, its just unfortunate that you get people on who just get there rocks off on upsetting people, allbeit a good thread and one that will go on for a long time, its people like him that give good forums a bad name. I left one forum because it was full of people like him.... Yes I clean my chain and sprocks off with WD40 from a rag, but still will use a lube on my drive gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRANDYMAN Posted September 11, 2008 Share Posted September 11, 2008 Have been using WD-40 in an aerospace environement since the mid 70,s.We were advised to keep it away from rubber seals and gaiters etc.Draw your own conclusions.Not good for your lungs either but then neither was Evostick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Airhead Posted September 11, 2008 Moderator Share Posted September 11, 2008 Yes I clean my chain and sprocks off with WD40 from a rag, but still will use a lube on my drive gear. You tell em ChicagiXS, Words of wisdom indeed IMHO OK this is what I do...When the chain needs a re lube I shock horror Spray WD40 on a rag, not on the chain, And use this to clean the chain rollers and side links. When its all clean and shiny i then spray on my chosen chain lube. What im trying to say here is that WD40 used sensibly is not the demon its being portrayed as IMHO And as for Gman, Chicago wouldnt be half as windy if he left...Another IMHO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-man Posted September 12, 2008 Author Share Posted September 12, 2008 OMG, there's enough tools in this thread to fill a motorcycle repair shop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-man Posted September 12, 2008 Author Share Posted September 12, 2008 Even though this Gman is from the same place as me... Really? You're from Chicago? We'll see... You get a beer at Wrigley Field, how much is it? And what brand is it? And how is it served? Who's the best pitcher on the Cubs, and what's he known for? What color is the picasso, and where is it? You're downtown, you wanna pizza....where are you gonna go for it? What's on a maxwell street polish? Where is Maxwell Street? What's around there? What's the area like? You drive down the ryan and as you pass 35th, what do you see? What's the name of the neighborhood, and who grew up there? Where's uptown? What's the area like? What's south of there, and what type of person are you likely to find walking around, and with who? Name a part of the city that cops and firemen tend to live in. Who lives in humboldt park? How about wicker park? How about bucktown? Where's the cheeziest place to get a tattoo in Chicago? How do you pronounce the number 3? Coz see, I suspect that you're actually one of these WANKERS, but posting under another account. Not that I really give a shit...we all need a hobby, after all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-man Posted September 12, 2008 Author Share Posted September 12, 2008 Have been using WD-40 in an aerospace environement since the mid 70,s.We were advised to keep it away from rubber seals and gaiters etc.Draw your own conclusions. I will certainly attempt to, if you could explain the reasoning behind the advise given to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator mervin Posted September 12, 2008 Moderator Share Posted September 12, 2008 Fit a scottoiler and stop arguing about overpriced waterdisplacer in a can, WD40 is overpriced i use a cheaper version to waterproof bits of the bike/as releasing fluiid but chain no way, chain saw chain oil is good does not flick around a badly as ornery oil and is a lot cheaper than aerosol cans of chain lube that last 20 seconds, Merv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Airhead Posted September 12, 2008 Moderator Share Posted September 12, 2008 OMG, there's enough tools in this thread to fill a motorcycle repair shop. And youre not the sharpest one!! Coz see, I suspect that you're actually one of these WANKERS, but posting under another account. And that means everyone other than you does it?, since no one actually agreed entirely with your unique maintenance regime. Accept it Gene, youre WRONG, by popular opinion. Try not to get so angry about it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Exupnutta Posted September 12, 2008 Share Posted September 12, 2008 I will certainly attempt to. No idea why, but I came accross this and it reminded me of you.... Click: Launch This File By Clicking Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Live to ride Ride to live Posted September 12, 2008 Share Posted September 12, 2008 No idea why, but I came accross this and it reminded me of you.... Click: Launch This File By Clicking Here Nice .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-man Posted September 12, 2008 Author Share Posted September 12, 2008 Talk sense to a fool and he calls you foolish. -Euripides I rest my case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Airhead Posted September 12, 2008 Moderator Share Posted September 12, 2008 Talk sense to a fool and he calls you foolish. -Euripides I rest my case. Talk sense to a Wa**er and he calls you all Coz see, I suspect that you're actually one of these WANKERS, but posting under another account. - Oldgit I rest mine too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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