bralkan Posted March 14, 2008 Share Posted March 14, 2008 Alright, my torque wrench and valve compressor should be here today. I have the "top end kit" with all the gaskets and such. (the top-end kit at the top of the page - https://www.partsnmore.com/cat_index.php?mo...ategory=engine) I've already taken the gas tank and carbs off the bike and looked at it last night - It looks tight - is this really doable without removing the engine from the frame? I'd like to replace the head gasket, will this be made available by just removing the top-most part of the case? (My terminology blows - I am talking about the top part that must be un-bolted in a specific sequence). I have been reviewing both my Haynes and the manual Drewpy posted. I will have both with me. I also want to "de-coke" the pistons - does this just involve scrapping the top of the piston or are there other parts? Please put anything and everything down you would think of when rebuilding the top end like this. I'd like to replace as many gaskets / parts as possible while I have this thing open. I am a newbie when it comes to all this, so you can't put down to much information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XSwheels Posted March 14, 2008 Share Posted March 14, 2008 I also want to "de-coke" the pistons - does this just involve scrapping the top of the piston or are there other parts? Go to your kitchen and get a spoon. Scrape the piston tops; combustion chamber ,valve faces, exhaust ports. The spoon will not scratch things and will remove the heavy carbon. You can finish up with a nylon scrub pad. Install an old spark plug to protect the threads and keep the crap out of your good plug. Clean the exhaust pipe with a drill mounted wire wheel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator drewpy Posted March 14, 2008 Moderator Share Posted March 14, 2008 Alright, my torque wrench and valve compressor should be here today. I have the "top end kit" with all the gaskets and such. (the top-end kit at the top of the page - https://www.partsnmore.com/cat_index.php?mo...ategory=engine) I've already taken the gas tank and carbs off the bike and looked at it last night - It looks tight - is this really doable without removing the engine from the frame? I'd like to replace the head gasket, will this be made available by just removing the top-most part of the case? (My terminology blows - I am talking about the top part that must be un-bolted in a specific sequence). I have been reviewing both my Haynes and the manual Drewpy posted. I will have both with me. I also want to "de-coke" the pistons - does this just involve scrapping the top of the piston or are there other parts? Please put anything and everything down you would think of when rebuilding the top end like this. I'd like to replace as many gaskets / parts as possible while I have this thing open. I am a newbie when it comes to all this, so you can't put down to much information. its do-able, don't bash the cyl head on the fins if it is stuck. soak some diesel oil down the stud holes and leave to soak. corrosion is worse at the front studs. use the sequence for undoing the cam cover and head nuts. make sure you get all the gasket material off the faces, but don't scrape with a metal object, use shaped wood. don't forget the black O rings above and the red O rings under the cylinder bore replace all gaskets with new, but don't use any gasket goo on the top cam over as you open the gap for the camshaft bearing surface and drop oil pressure. clean the barrels BEFORE starting work as shit will get into the bottom end. put rags under the cyl head when lifting to stop more shit getting in. give the cam cap a good polish when off the bike. (might as well when its off) don't forget to lap your valves and keep all springs and valves in the same set. use sandwich bags and LABEL everything. don't be tempted to smooth the inlets or exhaust unless your a tuner. a rough bore surface promotes better gas flow than smooth. you can use a dremel with wire attachment to get into the nooks and crannies whilst decoking. its said that solvol the piston crown afterwards stops the carbon building up on them. check the rings for breakages but dont remove them if you don't need to as they snap dead easy. take your time and enjoy the experience, don't try and complete it to a dead line as you tend to cut corners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bralkan Posted March 15, 2008 Author Share Posted March 15, 2008 I started cleaning the engine before I start taking the head / cam cover off. I also didn't get my tools in today Anyways, I took the left chain cover off (the one with the clutch cable). I have a slight problem getting it back on - does the cover just slip back on over the rod for the gear change pedal with the spring mechanism slipping over the pushrod for the clutch? I slid the cover back on and what I thought was the pushrod, but the clutch doesn't seem to be engaging. Anything to look for? Also, should the stator / coil wiring be ok if brake cleaner got on it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k91 Posted March 15, 2008 Share Posted March 15, 2008 Anyways, I took the left chain cover off (the one with the clutch cable). I have a slight problem getting it back on - does the cover just slip back on over the rod for the gear change pedal with the spring mechanism slipping over the pushrod for the clutch? I slid the cover back on and what I thought was the pushrod, but the clutch doesn't seem to be engaging. Anything to look for? Did the ball bearing in the clutch fall out maybe? Or you could try running through the adjustment procedure again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bralkan Posted March 15, 2008 Author Share Posted March 15, 2008 Did the ball bearing in the clutch fall out maybe? Or you could try running through the adjustment procedure again. Well, when I put the spring mechanism in that the clutch cable connects to, how far out should it be to start with? I tried getting it in where it was already extended a bit and couldn't get the cover on. I put it in so it droped down all the way and got the cover on. I could then shift up, but I could not shift down into 1st. I also don't think it is shifting up through all the gears. If I shift up, it does shift back down. Should it have the full range of gears when it is off? I've looked at both Drewpy's guide and haynes - I can't adjust that screw on the plate either way. Is it supposed to move that ball bearing inside forwards or backwards? Le sigh. Any ideas? Am I just putting the spring mechanism in wrong? I didn't even notice the thing wasn't permanently attached to the damn cover Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bralkan Posted March 15, 2008 Author Share Posted March 15, 2008 double post =/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator drewpy Posted March 16, 2008 Moderator Share Posted March 16, 2008 Well, when I put the spring mechanism in that the clutch cable connects to, how far out should it be to start with? I tried getting it in where it was already extended a bit and couldn't get the cover on. I put it in so it droped down all the way and got the cover on. I could then shift up, but I could not shift down into 1st. I also don't think it is shifting up through all the gears. If I shift up, it does shift back down. Should it have the full range of gears when it is off? I've looked at both Drewpy's guide and haynes - I can't adjust that screw on the plate either way. Is it supposed to move that ball bearing inside forwards or backwards? Le sigh. Any ideas? Am I just putting the spring mechanism in wrong? I didn't even notice the thing wasn't permanently attached to the damn cover if the srew part of the actuating mechanism has come off, there are two ways of putting it back in. there is a ball bearing, but it is in the screw mechanism. i think that there is another but at the clutch end between the clutch mushroom and the rod. the cover will be tensioned slightly when you first put it on but not in any major way. the adjustment is merely taking up the slack between mech and rod. it should be obvious if the screw mech is off as it doesn't follow the line of the clutch cable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bralkan Posted March 22, 2008 Author Share Posted March 22, 2008 Well, I have the top end off the engine. I will have to compress the valve springs and replace the seals in the morning, replace the head gasket, and then refit everything. Anything else I should check? I will post pictures in a bit - the left side, the one burning oil, has black soot on the piston head. I will clean that. The other head has carbon on it as well, but it is brownish. I will clean that too. Drewpy - I left the engine on the frame! Woah! There were a few tight spots. I will wonder how I will get a bolt or two back on later. Should be interesting. Question on removing the engine, for future reference - on the sprocket that the chain goes to on the engine: how the hell do you get it off? The guide says "bend down washer and engage the transmission". How exactly does that work? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator drewpy Posted March 22, 2008 Moderator Share Posted March 22, 2008 Question on removing the engine, for future reference - on the sprocket that the chain goes to on the engine: how the hell do you get it off? The guide says "bend down washer and engage the transmission". How exactly does that work? Thanks. put the bike in gear and get someone to put the back brake on. then you can undo the sprocket nut after bending the locking tab away. It stops the sprocket turning as you undo the nut. check the cam chain whist the head is off and also the tensioner blades for wear. they will have a bit of a groove in them, but not much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bralkan Posted March 24, 2008 Author Share Posted March 24, 2008 put the bike in gear and get someone to put the back brake on. then you can undo the sprocket nut after bending the locking tab away. It stops the sprocket turning as you undo the nut. check the cam chain whist the head is off and also the tensioner blades for wear. they will have a bit of a groove in them, but not much. well, i'm almost done putting it back together. The 2nd valve I went to replace bent my compressor. My mechanic did the other 3 valves for me free of charge. I am down to putting the head cover back on - a bolt broke putting it in; everything is fine but I need a new bolt. Are the bolts standard or...? Any place to order new ones or should any hardware store provide them? I have another question: Taking out the cover bolts, I made the mistake of thinking all the 8mm bolts were the same length and did not note which hole they came out of exactly (some reason I noticed it on the 6mm bolts, but not the 8s...sigh). I have 5 of one "medium" length; 2 of longer length, and 1 of shorter length. Where do they go? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator drewpy Posted March 24, 2008 Moderator Share Posted March 24, 2008 well, i'm almost done putting it back together. The 2nd valve I went to replace bent my compressor. My mechanic did the other 3 valves for me free of charge. I am down to putting the head cover back on - a bolt broke putting it in; everything is fine but I need a new bolt. Are the bolts standard or...? Any place to order new ones or should any hardware store provide them? I have another question: Taking out the cover bolts, I made the mistake of thinking all the 8mm bolts were the same length and did not note which hole they came out of exactly (some reason I noticed it on the 6mm bolts, but not the 8s...sigh). I have 5 of one "medium" length; 2 of longer length, and 1 of shorter length. Where do they go? just use trial and error, rest them on the threads and see how much they protude. i think its about 10 - 15 mm, i upgraded mine to stainless and polished them, so you can use any steel bolt with a washer! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bralkan Posted March 24, 2008 Author Share Posted March 24, 2008 just use trial and error, rest them on the threads and see how much they protude. i think its about 10 - 15 mm, i upgraded mine to stainless and polished them, so you can use any steel bolt with a washer! Got the bolts.... But of course, something else is wrong... I put the cover back on and the kickstart would not turn over. With the cover off, the kickstart turns the engine / camshaft etc over. ? How would putting the cover on cause the engine not to turn over? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator drewpy Posted March 25, 2008 Moderator Share Posted March 25, 2008 Got the bolts.... But of course, something else is wrong... I put the cover back on and the kickstart would not turn over. With the cover off, the kickstart turns the engine / camshaft etc over. ? How would putting the cover on cause the engine not to turn over? all i can think of is the rocker arm fouling the inspection caps preventing the engine from turning, oh and maybe the rev counter worm drive not engaging on the cam properly. If i think of any more i'll let you know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bralkan Posted March 25, 2008 Author Share Posted March 25, 2008 all i can think of is the rocker arm fouling the inspection caps preventing the engine from turning, oh and maybe the rev counter worm drive not engaging on the cam properly. If i think of any more i'll let you know. I was thinking it might be that counter worm... I didn't have time to try putting it on again last night, so I will try again today. Any advice on making sure that gear sits on the camshaft right? =P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator drewpy Posted March 26, 2008 Moderator Share Posted March 26, 2008 I was thinking it might be that counter worm... I didn't have time to try putting it on again last night, so I will try again today. Any advice on making sure that gear sits on the camshaft right? =P never had this problem, maybe its moved? you could always try and manualy turn it as you engage the cover via the cable!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bralkan Posted March 27, 2008 Author Share Posted March 27, 2008 never had this problem, maybe its moved? you could always try and manualy turn it as you engage the cover via the cable!! Could it be a timing issue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator drewpy Posted March 27, 2008 Moderator Share Posted March 27, 2008 Could it be a timing issue? It could be, then the piston could be hitting an open valve? why don't you unscrew all the adjusters out and see if that helps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bralkan Posted April 2, 2008 Author Share Posted April 2, 2008 It could be, then the piston could be hitting an open valve? why don't you unscrew all the adjusters out and see if that helps Alright, I got it. It was a timing issue (i am a dumbass). Anyways, after I put it together the dowl on the vice-bolt of the kick start broke and I couldnt' start it (Lever obviously wasn't going to work and I have a bad starter motor). New lever came in today and I put it on. Bike started up but the engine was "Rattling". I assume its the cam chain? Does it have to be renewed or do I need to increase the tension on the tensioner blade? (I had left it as it was). It will be this weekend before I can get the cover off again and check it out. SO, any ideas? Thanks, as always. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator drewpy Posted April 3, 2008 Moderator Share Posted April 3, 2008 Alright, I got it. It was a timing issue (i am a dumbass). Anyways, after I put it together the dowl on the vice-bolt of the kick start broke and I couldnt' start it (Lever obviously wasn't going to work and I have a bad starter motor). New lever came in today and I put it on. Bike started up but the engine was "Rattling". I assume its the cam chain? Does it have to be renewed or do I need to increase the tension on the tensioner blade? (I had left it as it was). It will be this weekend before I can get the cover off again and check it out. SO, any ideas? Thanks, as always. did you check the tensioner blades for wear, when the head was off? the tensioner is automatic, did you remove the 3mm bolt holding the tensioner closed to enable it to be bolted back in place? ( in the manual) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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