BIG BIKES FOR LITTLE EXPERIENCE

[rob_arrowsmith]

Yeah my dad has a GSXR 600 and to be honest more power than I could confidently handle, hence sticking with a XJ600N for a couple of years

[Tommy2Wheeler]

ok heres my opinion on it. im about to rant so please bare with me

I do not think at 17 u shud be able to have access to bigger bikes even tho they are restricted

here are my reasons

1) at 17 u cannot go to test on anything bigger than a 125, nor can u train on anything other than a 125 untill ur 21

so to do test at 17 on a 125, then go get say a 600cc bike is silly. even tho its restricted u have never ridden a bike of this power so tbh i think its bloody silly

oooo jealous then so is 15 year olds on 125 moto gp bikes???

in my opinion we youngsters are restricted by the cost of insurance, and having the fucking thing restricted itself!! i wanted an r6, but financially and usably not ecconomical, so i went for a hornet instead. anyway,

at the end of the day people are gonna hurt themselves be it on a scooter or a blade or whatever, age only comes into it when you attempt to point the finger. and if you restrict us youngsters we'll only find a way of making what we have go faster still. there are many contributing factors.

like cars, insurance is rediculously expensive, so at 18 i have a 1.5 civic, comes under the 1.6 *big engine class* but with some tampering it goes like shit.

some of this may sound immature, and frankly some of it probably is. but in my view the world is getting harder for us bikers with all the other silly tossers around without us turning on each other....

[SRJ999]

Like Kennyboy, I returned as a born-again about five years ago. I'd had a variety of bikes in the 70s & 80s but nothing overly powerful; the biggest was an XS650 twin. Having decided that a return was overdue, I stayed away from arse rockets at first and ended up with the TDM 900, which I love still. Having ridden for a while, I tried (and eventually bought) an R6 too. I had that for 7500 miles and loved every miniute (except maybe an impromtu off-roading incident at Cadwell Park). The R6 is now gone but I'll be on the look out for an R1 next year.

Sorry - back on topic; insurance is certainly an issue and born-agains are only slightly less of a risk to insurance companies than youngsters, as I discovered. Fortunately, with age comes better salaries(generally), so I could still afford to do it. Then there's the issue of getting on a bike after 20-odd years to discover that even a 400 of today will blow away the 750s I remember from my youth. And they handle. And brake better. All this actually provides a potentially lethal mix if not handled properly.

BikeSafe has cropped up a few times in here. I've done two sessions with Kent Police and personally cannot recommend them highly enough. You get out whatever you want. I wanted to be able to handle the R6 quickly and safely; a feat that was achieved after a long day's assessment. The coppers were approachable, very helpful and bloody quick on their Pans, which was a little disturbing round the country lanes.

I also think there is a case for a bit of equality in this car/bike novice argument. Why make a motorcyclist go through so many hoops and age brackets and NOT do similar for car drivers? You can argue that a car is not as dangerous (true) but a young driver is likely to be just as liable to show off as a bike rider. possibly more so, if the unofficial meets I have seen are anything to go by.

Finaly (honestly); I think that EVERY learner driver should be made to go pillion to get a greater awareness of the road, other road users and the associated hazards as seen from a motorcyclist's point of view.

[yoda]

I lnow how to cut the accident rate of motorcyclists in half, globally.

That is to ensure that all car drivers spend a year on two wheels and pass a test to show that they actually have ridden, before they are allowed a provisional car licence.

[iomrob]

I lnow how to cut the accident rate of motorcyclists in half, globally.

That is to ensure that all car drivers spend a year on two wheels and pass a test to show that they actually have ridden, before they are allowed a provisional car licence.

agree 100% .i have always said that, the problem would be making sure they did the miles to learn .

back on topic.

there will always be for and against in a poll like this

im for a step system. if i had been able to afford a 900/1000cc when i passed my test way back then, i would have killed myself, as i was a "i know it all, know how to do it" teenager, but i know not all are like that.

the problem is though people who make laws like that , dont know feck all about riding bikes.

[jonnie]

i passed my test at 17 , i had bikes from being 7 yrs -------- i jumped to a gsx 600 then to a gsx 750 then i had a fzr 1000 .------------ now im older & want a bike again i would be happy with a 600 fazer to get me back in to it .

i driver over a 1200 miles a week in he car .

but i still think they should stick to the current laws to many bikers geting hurt ---------- but to many youg kamakazee kids on scooters ------------- but then weve all done it !

[Pvt_Joker]

I started life on motorbikes late.... i passed my CBT at 19, and 2 months later passed my Test, i went onto a YZF R-125 Rossi Replica, and have not looked back since, I have now been riding about 9 months and can honestly say i have gained alot of experiance and knowledge from riding a smaller bike,

I think these restrictions are a good thing, but i do also think it is wrong for people 21+ to be able to get straight onto big bikes, in my opinion same restrictions should apply regardless of age,

You need experiance to ride a bike properly, yes maturity helps but only take you part of the way there

[Ttaskmaster]

Can't really put a generalised value on an individual's experience.

I'm smart (ish), sensible and fully appreciate how badly fucked up I can get if I am stupid on my bike.

With 40HP I can really cause some damage - So with 196HP on a fast sporty bike.......

I did DAS and spent a few months on a 125 before upgrading. I had 3 offs on the 125, none of which were directly my fault and none of which involved another vehicle. Not even a scare on the big bike.

My younger ex spent 2 years on a 125, upgraded and had several incidents. She rides like a twat, period. It's nothing to do with age, bike or anything like that... it's just that no-one's killed her yet. Even after coming off the bike at 70, she still rides like a twat and IMO should not be allowed on the road.

Putting car drivers on bikes first will not help them become better drivers... unless you put everyone in vans and trucks, too.

Focus needs to be on better training, restriction on vehicles and frighteningly serious enforcement of road laws.

[fosdyke]

Focus needs to be on better training, restriction on vehicles and frighteningly serious enforcement of road laws.

For what it's worth - I think that most of the 'training' that you get today (admittedly better than before) is totally inadequate particularly for young, inexperienced riders. I agree there should be some parity between car and bike riders, but what people may be overlooking is that at 16 you can be let out on the road with a day's experience and, generally only 2hrs of that on the road! Learner car drivers will for the most part have to complete around 30 hours of training with an instructor, before taking the test - all of which will be on the road. There has been a tendency in recent years to rush people through 'courses' from 2 - 5 days, and think that this will make up for experience! I have seen this in training youngsters to sail - you can do a 2 day course and get your level 2 with NO real experience of different conditions! When I learned we underwent weeks of being exposed to the techniques and skills of basic sailing BEFORE we were officially assessed.

The problem here of course is how do you do that with a 'solo' machine? - So perhaps there is an opportunity for candidates to 'learn' under the same conditions as car drivers - ie not in a condensed and pressured course - spending as much time as they (or their instructor needs) 'off road' and then putting in the hours on the road - it could be done an hour at a time perhaps until they are ready - this would give candidates better experience of the road, their bikes etc etc and should be done for ALL novice riders regardless of age. What you will find with experienced car drivers, (and I speak from personal experience) time spent driving in traffic, and anticiptaing what the other pr**s are going to do is invaluable. Then maybe - particularly for these riders we could skip the 125cc restriction and move up to say 250/300 - the biggest problem I had when doing my DAS was the lack of opportunity to practise because of the restrictions! For me to have contemplated anything much bigger than the 500cc bike I got after passing would have been suicidal, given my sheer lack of riding experience - again due to the restrictions.

I don't think that just youngsters should be restricted - but ALL novices - and car drivers too. Our licenses are considered to be 'probationary' for 2 years - a restriction could run alongside this perhaps - only now do I feel ready to try an R1 - and I am still learning and improving.............all the time.

off soapbox now!

[little dave]

the thing is that some young riders have the experience already. they have the maturity to ride safely, responsibly, and smart. its not fair to punish that half dozen.

there are also people who ride like twats because they enjoy the rush. some get over it and mature into responsible riders. some dont.

the differnce is that here in the states there are some speed limits. if you are law abiding, youre never gonna get over 75 mph in anything.

however, in the land of the autobahn, it makes real sense real real real sense to be absolutely sure that every driver be able to handle all the horses that they can squeeze out of thier motorcycle (and car for that matter)

special courses for learning the basic physics of motion at high speed. braking, cornering, skid control etc.

more in depth than the basic classes to get a road license.

i am also (shoot me now) a huge proponent of required testing of persons over a certain age.

for every inexperienced kid, there is probably 2 senior citizens on the road in cars and whatnot that have the reaction time of a garden slug.

and i think that any driver under 21 caught being a twat on the road by racing, wheelies, nosies, burnouts, or other unsafe practices should be forced to retest at the very least. after all, if they cant spot a cop lurking before they stunt, how can we (the people around them on the road) expect that they can spot and react to any other hazzard?

now i am guilty of the occasional wheelie myself, but only in open spaces, like empty park lots with nothing else around me.

i used to ride a 125cc as a kid. all 4 feet and 75 pounds of me. never had a spill.

after a 25 year vacation, i got back on a 175cc. it pulls my 105 pound self around like its a 250cc

the biggetst i would ever want to go is a 250cc and for me it would be like riding a 500.

im small, im light, and i know my limits.

if i get a few more years under me, that may change as i get larger bikes and learn how to handle them. but i dont like the idea of slippinig my wrist to quick and getting a reverse cowboy from my bike.

as long as i can go on the freeway and have 15-20 mph extra to give for evasive moves over the posted limit of 75 im good. thats all i would need in a bike at the most.

right now i dont ride on the freeway, as my bike maxes at 65. i could, but i have no room for an extra boost of speed if i need it.

[Fahren]

passed test at 17 and bought a brand new 350 YPVS N2 rode that for 18mnths then got me a CBR1000 then got a FZR1000 Genesis...

No one who has just passed there test should be allowed to get on the biggest bike there is...its a helluva jump from a 125 to 1000....even a 600 would be a big jump. I think the 33bhp restriction is good and something similar should be applied to car drivers too such as the 1ltr engine size someone else mentioned....

Ive just returned to bikes after a long break (family n kids etc), no mid life crisis here nor am i trying to regain my youth!!...ive always loved biking, cars are fine but the funs in riding my bike. I had the chance to get a ZX9R but figured its been that long ill get a cheap FZ600 not too fast handles well and cos its old im re-learning the maintainence side of biking lol (need a bigger wallet).

In the month and a half ive been back on bikes (covered 2k miles so far) ive noticed the same problems are still there i.e. road surfaces/conditions are fooking abyssmal and most drivers dont know your there (especially me cos i cant ride too long with lights on otherwise the battery drains) dayglo will have to be worn methinks lol.....

[clarke]

I started at 25 on my 50cc scooter & have commuted daily on 2 wheels ever since through city traffic - had my scooter for just short of 2 years & in that time had one accident when a 4x4 decided to reverse at a set of red lights without looking... wasn't my fault but made me realise that I was more vunerable on a small bike.

Moved on to my XVS125 Dragstar which had more presence than my scooter. Still, had one incident on that at a roundabout when a car didn't give way and I instinctively pulled my front brake & bike slid away again not my fault but experience may have taught me not to pull the front brake on a roundabout?

After 2 years on my 125 (passing my test just over a year ago) I recently completed an advanced rider course which gave me the confidence to buy a bigger bike. Just bought a XVS1300 - though it's restricted to 33bhp (which put my insurance up!) and to be honest it still seems very powerful. It'll be restricted until next June then the restrictor comes off...

Sometime after next June I may trade in my 125 for a 600 (something like a Fazer) though am more wary about this style of bike as my cruisers are about laid back approach. I've avoided sports bikes as I always thought if I have a bike that will go like a bullet then that's how I'd drive it - especially when I was younger.

Do I think teens should be able to ride any bike? No I don't, but then again I don't think a teen should be able to drive any car either as there's no substitute for experience. Obviously, there's always exceptions, but as a general rule I'd say no.