This is a really difficult subject. I have to say that I agree with everyone here that it's ok to protect your own property with whatever force is "necessary". This being the key word. If I found someone trying to steal my bike I would react badly. Why not? I've worked hard for this? They haven't. Like others I sadly am not a fan of the police as it seems that motorists are an easy target because we are easy to trace via registrations etc and therefore are easy to fine. I live in a flat in the centre of Helensburgh and so far this year my wife has had a parking ticket and I have been fined £100 as I forgot to SORN a car even though it was taxed and MOT'd and off the road. Still this is the law but what an arse it is!

Police justice is soft at best to offenders. There is a youtube vid earlier in this thread and if you listen to the end the guy caught breaking in to the guy's property was given a police caution and released!!! How is that going to deter him?

Sadly, because of this soft attitude by police, I have agree that whatever force is necessary is appropriate and if violence is the necessary force then so be it! They deserve ALL they get.

Ok rant over, i'm going to lie down in dark room.

I live in a flat in the centre of Helensburgh

Have a look at my avitar Davie and guess were I quite often went to.

if you can see them in your gun sights you do not need a tracker

This is a really difficult subject. I have to say that I agree with everyone here that it's ok to protect your own property with whatever force is "necessary". This being the key word. If I found someone trying to steal my bike I would react badly. Why not? I've worked hard for this? They haven't. Like others I sadly am not a fan of the police as it seems that motorists are an easy target because we are easy to trace via registrations etc and therefore are easy to fine. I live in a flat in the centre of Helensburgh and so far this year my wife has had a parking ticket and I have been fined £100 as I forgot to SORN a car even though it was taxed and MOT'd and off the road. Still this is the law but what an arse it is! Police justice is soft at best to offenders. There is a youtube vid earlier in this thread and if you listen to the end the guy caught breaking in to the guy's property was given a police caution and released!!! How is that going to deter him? Sadly, because of this soft attitude by police, I have agree that whatever force is necessary is appropriate and if violence is the necessary force then so be it! They deserve ALL they get. Ok rant over, i'm going to lie down in dark room.

I'm not convinced it's the fault of the police that scroates get off with cautions rather than sent to prison. The penal system is underfunded, the prisons are overcrowded so sentences are reduced which in turn leads to police being discouraged from arresting, which in turn lets the scroates think they can do it again. I'm sure most police officers would love to have these toe-rags locked up but they can only work with the system they have.

should have an island some where to send them off to...
And this time lets try to make it some where that isnt nice and sunny.
but the deadly spiders and snakes should stay the same..

maybe we could import some inland taipan's or something and slap them on one of those islands off of scotland and send them there,
give them some fishing rods and a shovel. and make one cement shelter big enough for people to sleep in. "they can take turns sleeping if it gets over crowded. so if you made a shelter big enough for a thousand people to sleep in at one time. give em 6 hours sleep and then you can squash 4 thousand in there.

And any way the taipans would keep the numbers down.

of course that would be for the more severe crimes..
Like Murder.. or trying to take MY stuff..

for the less serious crimes.
then just send them off to old abandoned oil rigs..

or park one of those ships they would usually sink in the middle of the ocean. with its anchor Welded to the bottom of the ship cemented to the ocean floor. (probably have 6 or 7 anchors)

again some fishing rods would probably be helpfull. dead inmates would make reasonable bait id imagine.
and they could have a solar still to make water.

How about just removing the bleeding heart brigade, auditers and those that run the system that need to grow a pair, and allow the courts, probation, police and prison officer to do the their jobs without both hands tied behind there backs and mountains of meaningless paper work.

dunno the 25k a year to keep some one in prison sux..

so i still vote "island + fend for them selfs"

its going to work out cheaper in the end.

I go with bennyboy.

HiMike 1949,

Mmmm I wonder.....?

I do have some sympathy for the police. The peal system IS underfunded but with the fashion for political correctness and the protection of offenders rights it seems that the original crime and consequently the victims are relegated almost into second place.

How often do you see offenders being let off with a caution or community service for crimes which have left the victim(s) traumatised? A friend of mines son was sent to prison after his release he told me how nice his cell was and what courses he was offered whilst being inside......and as someone mentioned the cost of keeping people in prison is ridiculous!

I thinks offenders rights are all wrong, yes someone should be viewed as innocent until proven guilty but once this had been proven I too would vote for an island. Prison is too soft and not a deterrent.

I know I have a relatively simplistic viewpoint but what are the alternatives based on previous comments?

we tried to put them in prison ships in the 80's, too much outcry from the liberals

we tried to put them in prison ships in the 80's, too much outcry from the liberals

Yep, I remember that. Bear in mind also that the Human Rights Brigade would fiercely campaign against any changes in the current balance of victim/offender, with inevitable challenges through the European Courts that they would most likely win. Dont forget that our govt is also desparate to keep criminals out of prison because of costs, its cheaper to keep them on the streets. Its my view that we also tend to put the wrong type of offenders in prisons, violent offenders are less likely to be jailed than someone who has committed some kind of swindle, be it of the state, private company, bank etc. (swindling banks!!! thats a laugh now aint it)

If you cach some one sealing your belongings and manage to get the police there while there under citizen arrest ! what are they going to doif the person you catch says you assalted them ? as there is no oftern no one else about for a witness they will have to take what both people concened down the police station which could end up with yourself arrested for assalt which will probably be dealt with more serverly than twoc . this is all down to the goody two shoes people looking after the country which inmy opinion is a load of crap. This is what happened to a lad I know he found a lad breaking into his work van while out on a job with his work mate and bundled him into the back of his van and called the police, the police turned up and they tryed to arrest him for unlawfull imprissonment which he went to cort and had to pay the lad who was braking in to his van damages, The lad who was breaking into his van got off with no charges even tho there were two of them telling the same story!! where is the justice in that in my opinion the laws in this country are an arse simple as that, We should all stop working and start taking what we fancy from other people and the law can do nothing !

this is where doing a counter act against the other party comes into effect. it gets thrown out of court due to lack of evidence.

but you still have to attend court for the judge to dismiss your case, and ? you can't claim for loss of earnings either.