Moderator Airhead Posted November 20, 2008 Moderator Share Posted November 20, 2008 Well, we will never know now... Just been out for a test ride, stopped off at my mate's house, went in for half an hour and when I went back out the bike was gone. I would have heard it being started up, and the steering lock was on, so I guess it's been thrown in the back of a van and is on it's way to being broken for parts! Reported to the police, but I'd be very surprised if it ever sees the light of day in one piece again. Sometimes it's best just to know when you're beaten A real shame too as it was a nice bike. That could be the end of my biking days before they even began - I can't justify the expense of a replacement when insurance excess and premium increase is taken into account. Cheers for all the help though, Ewan Bummer! i am really sorry to hear that Ewan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimR Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 Well, we will never know now... Just been out for a test ride, stopped off at my mate's house, went in for half an hour and when I went back out the bike was gone. I would have heard it being started up, and the steering lock was on, so I guess it's been thrown in the back of a van and is on it's way to being broken for parts! Reported to the police, but I'd be very surprised if it ever sees the light of day in one piece again. Sometimes it's best just to know when you're beaten A real shame too as it was a nice bike. That could be the end of my biking days before they even began - I can't justify the expense of a replacement when insurance excess and premium increase is taken into account. Cheers for all the help though, Ewan Sorry to hear that .... after all your time taken fixing it .... but you may find another bike at a reasonable price Regards Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark h Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 Well, we will never know now... Just been out for a test ride, stopped off at my mate's house, went in for half an hour and when I went back out the bike was gone. I would have heard it being started up, and the steering lock was on, so I guess it's been thrown in the back of a van and is on it's way to being broken for parts! Reported to the police, but I'd be very surprised if it ever sees the light of day in one piece again. Sometimes it's best just to know when you're beaten A real shame too as it was a nice bike. That could be the end of my biking days before they even began - I can't justify the expense of a replacement when insurance excess and premium increase is taken into account. Cheers for all the help though, Ewan I`m truly sorry for your loss Ewan, But don`t give up, buy an old wreak, And do it up, Lot`s of fun, ( who am i kidding), Welcome to the world of "were on earth am i going to get that part" "i wonder what this bit is", CHIN UP, Mark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Brown Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 Ewen, Really sorry to hear about your bike... I have a 1987 FZ600 with similar electrical problems. I always assumed that older bikes were not so vulnerable to theft, but I'll be a bit more careful now! Jim, I hope you don't mind me jumping in on this thread, but it is so refrehing to fond somone who really knows the electrics of these bikes...!! I bought my FZ600 in July (an E-bay special cheap first bike!) The previous owner had had charging problems & put a new regulator / rectifier on it - It worked well enought for me to get it home!! It charges the battery (I put a new one on it) well at 13.5 volts with sidelights on, but when I put dipped headlights on (which should be normal riding practice) the voltage drops to just around 12 volts, and after about 2 hours of riding of course gives up & won't start the bike again. I have checked the alternator brushes which appear to be OK, springy enough & the rotor slip rings are reasonably clean. Stator coils measure about 0.4 ohms as per the manual. Other useful info is that I have a trickle charger which keeps it topped up lovely, I just can't trust it for long runs out. I'd really appreciate some assistance with where I should look next. Thanks, Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimR Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 Ewen, Really sorry to hear about your bike... I have a 1987 FZ600 with similar electrical problems. I always assumed that older bikes were not so vulnerable to theft, but I'll be a bit more careful now! Jim, I hope you don't mind me jumping in on this thread, but it is so refrehing to fond somone who really knows the electrics of these bikes...!! I bought my FZ600 in July (an E-bay special cheap first bike!) The previous owner had had charging problems & put a new regulator / rectifier on it - It worked well enought for me to get it home!! It charges the battery (I put a new one on it) well at 13.5 volts with sidelights on, but when I put dipped headlights on (which should be normal riding practice) the voltage drops to just around 12 volts, and after about 2 hours of riding of course gives up & won't start the bike again. I have checked the alternator brushes which appear to be OK, springy enough & the rotor slip rings are reasonably clean. Stator coils measure about 0.4 ohms as per the manual. Other useful info is that I have a trickle charger which keeps it topped up lovely, I just can't trust it for long runs out. I'd really appreciate some assistance with where I should look next. Thanks, Neil Hi Neil did you check the length of the brushes ? they may appear serviceable but are too short to do the job, There is a line scribed on the brush indicating the wear limit, If theres no line the brush needs to be replaced. If this is ok goto rectifier (see previous posts here). Has your bike bike got the green and brown wire going to the regulator or is it as the picture in the earlier post ? What voltage do you get at the battery with no lights on at 4k ? let me know regards Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Brown Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 Hi Neil did you check the length of the brushes ? they may appear serviceable but are too short to do the job, There is a line scribed on the brush indicating the wear limit, If theres no line the brush needs to be replaced. If this is ok goto rectifier (see previous posts here). Has your bike bike got the green and brown wire going to the regulator or is it as the picture in the earlier post ? What voltage do you get at the battery with no lights on at 4k ? let me know regards Jim Thanks Jim, The brushes are good, they are about 5mm longer than the scribed line. Rectifier is good - Diodes check out OK. I have the finned regulator / rectifier with the green brown wires which go to the brushes in the generator. (rotor) They have 10.5 volts accros them at 4k revs. I guess the regulator varies this voltage in order to control the charge voltage...? or maybe it's not that clever? At 4k Revs with no lights on I get 13.8V, no change for sidelights on, but it drops to 12.3 ish with dipped headlights. I tried disconnecting one of the headlights, ie halfing the load - no improvement. Some of the connections at the regulator are dirty, I'll try them next unless you have any better ideas. Cheers, Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EPP Posted November 21, 2008 Author Share Posted November 21, 2008 Thanks for your support everyone If I can get something really cheap i will. Then bolt it down... Worse things happen at sea. Now, to eBay. Ewan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimR Posted November 22, 2008 Share Posted November 22, 2008 Thanks Jim, The brushes are good, they are about 5mm longer than the scribed line. Rectifier is good - Diodes check out OK. I have the finned regulator / rectifier with the green brown wires which go to the brushes in the generator. (rotor) They have 10.5 volts accros them at 4k revs. I guess the regulator varies this voltage in order to control the charge voltage...? or maybe it's not that clever? At 4k Revs with no lights on I get 13.8V, no change for sidelights on, but it drops to 12.3 ish with dipped headlights. I tried disconnecting one of the headlights, ie halfing the load - no improvement. Some of the connections at the regulator are dirty, I'll try them next unless you have any better ideas. Cheers, Neil yep get those connections clean which regulator do you have ? the 47x ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilninggas Posted November 22, 2008 Share Posted November 22, 2008 god, that sucks! good luck gettin new wheels Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EPP Posted November 22, 2008 Author Share Posted November 22, 2008 Got a call form the police last night - they'd recovered the bike, found on a street a couple of miles from where it was stolen. Said it was on fire... Went to see it at the depot today and it looks like they'd tried to set fire to the fuel in the tank, resulting in only a little charring round the cap. There are a few other damaged/missing parts, including the exhaust (snapped down pipe), so although I've got it back I'm not at all convinced it's worth repairing (exhaust alone would cost about 400 quid). Battery was drained and it can't be jumped - the oil light just illuminates when the starter button is pressed. The relay doesn't appear to operate. Luckily my mate lives near the depot so I wheeled it round there for now and will have to either get it running there or have it picked up and delivered home. I'll possibly just break it for parts. Ewan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Airhead Posted November 22, 2008 Moderator Share Posted November 22, 2008 What about finger prints? arent they gonna bother then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EPP Posted November 22, 2008 Author Share Posted November 22, 2008 What about finger prints? arent they gonna bother then? Doesn't look like it, as the bike has been released to me. I've been told to ring the officer in charge of the investigation on Monday to find out what they have done/are doing to identify the thieves, but I doubt it will be much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimR Posted November 22, 2008 Share Posted November 22, 2008 Got a call form the police last night - they'd recovered the bike, found on a street a couple of miles from where it was stolen. Said it was on fire... Went to see it at the depot today and it looks like they'd tried to set fire to the fuel in the tank, resulting in only a little charring round the cap. There are a few other damaged/missing parts, including the exhaust (snapped down pipe), so although I've got it back I'm not at all convinced it's worth repairing (exhaust alone would cost about 400 quid). Battery was drained and it can't be jumped - the oil light just illuminates when the starter button is pressed. The relay doesn't appear to operate. Luckily my mate lives near the depot so I wheeled it round there for now and will have to either get it running there or have it picked up and delivered home. I'll possibly just break it for parts. Ewan Hi Ewan dont do that get it to me I'll get the old girl up & running again, including the exhaust system, for perhaps less then the exhaust. depends on where the front pipe is broke... let me know I am here to help or if you dont want to do it let me know how much you want for it Regards Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EPP Posted November 22, 2008 Author Share Posted November 22, 2008 Hi Jim, I am considering getting her up and running again, but I think my enthusiasm for the whole thing is a little low at the moment! The first step will be to get her started and try to ride back home. Once under cover I can assess the amount of work more carefully. But, off the top of my head after picking the bike up today, the damage is as follows: Broken Front L indicator Missing ignition and damage to surrounding plastics (cables cut, obviously). Snapped brake lever Missing L side body panel Missing frame plug (covers swingarm bolt?) Damage to fuse box (might just be missing cover) Possibly some damage to the tail section bodywork and frame (out of alignment...?) Down pipe cracked just as it goes under the engine (will attach picture if i get the chance) Fuel tank scratched, dented and scorched Front faring scratched on right hand side Possible damage to L footrest/exhaust bracket (it's hanging off, not sure if just unbolted) Gearbox feels different, seems to work though. Might be fine... Clutch lever much stiffer, might be nothing though There might be more on closer inspection. It's all relatively superficial, but having a quick look on ebay for spares suggests it could all add up, and it all takes time! If you lived a bit closer (i'm in Manchester) I might consider your offer to repair. If I decide to just sell it, you'll be the first to know. Cheers, Ewan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimR Posted November 22, 2008 Share Posted November 22, 2008 Hi Jim, I am considering getting her up and running again, but I think my enthusiasm for the whole thing is a little low at the moment! The first step will be to get her started and try to ride back home. Once under cover I can assess the amount of work more carefully. But, off the top of my head after picking the bike up today, the damage is as follows: Broken Front L indicator Missing ignition and damage to surrounding plastics (cables cut, obviously). Snapped brake lever Missing L side body panel Missing frame plug (covers swingarm bolt?) Damage to fuse box (might just be missing cover) Possibly some damage to the tail section bodywork and frame (out of alignment...?) Down pipe cracked just as it goes under the engine (will attach picture if i get the chance) Fuel tank scratched, dented and scorched Front faring scratched on right hand side Possible damage to L footrest/exhaust bracket (it's hanging off, not sure if just unbolted) Gearbox feels different, seems to work though. Might be fine... Clutch lever much stiffer, might be nothing though There might be more on closer inspection. It's all relatively superficial, but having a quick look on ebay for spares suggests it could all add up, and it all takes time! If you lived a bit closer (i'm in Manchester) I might consider your offer to repair. If I decide to just sell it, you'll be the first to know. Cheers, Ewan Ok Ewan, any help I can be on the rebuild ... a trip up to manchester is not out of the question ... in order to help you assess the problem ... Regards Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EPP Posted November 23, 2008 Author Share Posted November 23, 2008 Ok Ewan, any help I can be on the rebuild ... a trip up to manchester is not out of the question ... in order to help you assess the problem ... Regards Jim Went out to see the bike today. Managed to get her started eventually. Put fresh fuel in, took ages for engine to catch, either there was no fuel in the pipes or engine was flooded and took a while to clear. Idles slowly (about 700 revs), but didn't get her fully warmed up due to noise from broken exhaust! I think there may be some rubbish in the fuel tank that'll need clearing - could be obstructing fuel flow. But it will ultimately need a new tank and there is a large dent in this one! At least the electrics seem to be working. The exhaust is broken where down pipe two meets down pipe one on left of bike just under the gear shifter. The two halves of the break are offset by around 2cm and it was not possible to manipulate them back into alignment in the short time I messed with it. I thought that some repair tape might have at least allowed me to ride home, but this will only work if I can regain alignment. Removal of the exhaust would probably be necessary for a repair but, to be honest, it might not be worth it as looks a bit soft in other places. I don't really know how bad an exhaust can get before repair becomes impossible. I wasn't able to get a decent photo of the break. How would you go about repairing the exhaust? You're offer to come to Manchester is very generous, but I think I've got a pretty good idea of the extent of the damage (now I know the engine will actually run) and I reckon I'd be able to sort most of it out with a bit of time. The decision is whether to put money into repairing it, or cut my losses (time and money!) on this bike and sell it. Ewan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Brown Posted November 28, 2008 Share Posted November 28, 2008 Jim, Thanks again for your help, I cleaned all the connections between the reg / rect and alternator & it improved things a bit, however while doing that, I noticed some burn marks on the white cable from the stator, so I tried replacing the cabling. 3 wires direct from rectifier to stator, no joins. The diference was amazing, I now get 14.5 Volts at 4k revs with all the lights on. To celebrate, I went out & bought a freshly re-covered seat on Ebay!! I have learnt a lot from you all here, and now have a bike I can be confident in. Thanks again. Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimR Posted November 28, 2008 Share Posted November 28, 2008 Jim, Thanks again for your help, I cleaned all the connections between the reg / rect and alternator & it improved things a bit, however while doing that, I noticed some burn marks on the white cable from the stator, so I tried replacing the cabling. 3 wires direct from rectifier to stator, no joins. The diference was amazing, I now get 14.5 Volts at 4k revs with all the lights on. To celebrate, I went out & bought a freshly re-covered seat on Ebay!! I have learnt a lot from you all here, and now have a bike I can be confident in. Thanks again. Neil Hi Neil, Job done then 14.5v is great at that speed just double check that you are not over charging with the lights off that also should be 14.5 at 4k Regards Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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